No more non-pitch double deck

fwb

fwb

Well-Known Member
I'm sad to report that the one casino (only one I've seen in the region(?)) which had an excellent double deck game dealt face-up has switched over to normal pitch :(. 99.5% of players are happy about it and welcomed this change, and probably requested it because it's what everyone else does and is more "fun" :whip:
Those who have been there will know where I'm talking about.
 
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Great post. Very informative. Seems like no one will mention casino by name, even when they no longer have a game worth protecting.
 
It definitely is a shame to lose face up DD. But a good DD game is still good, pitch or shoe. It just may be a bit slower now.
 
Blue Efficacy said:
It definitely is a shame to lose face up DD. But a good DD game is still good, pitch or shoe. It just may be a bit slower now.
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Slower, how so? A good pitch dealer can deliver significantly more cards per hour than her shoe counterpart. Just look at the physical mechanics involved. In shoe games the dealer has to reach all the way to the mouth of the shoe every card, then slide that card across the table directly in front of each individual player. This could result in a 3-4 foot movement for each card. In a pitch game a veteran dealer has no arm movement, but rather a finger/thumb/wrist motion and I've seen some who can actually maintain 2 or 3 cards airborne simultaneously. I never seen a study as to the exact difference in speed, but my best guess would be around 20% faster.
 
bj bob said:
Slower, how so? A good pitch dealer can deliver significantly more cards per hour than her shoe counterpart. Just look at the physical mechanics involved. In shoe games the dealer has to reach all the way to the mouth of the shoe every card, then slide that card across the table directly in front of each individual player. This could result in a 3-4 foot movement for each card. In a pitch game a veteran dealer has no arm movement, but rather a finger/thumb/wrist motion and I've seen some who can actually maintain 2 or 3 cards airborne simultaneously. I never seen a study as to the exact difference in speed, but my best guess would be around 20% faster.
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Sure, the dealer can (they certainly don't always, a fast shoe dealer will easily beat an average pitch dealer) physically deal the cards faster. But the actual playing part, all the little things add up. A player being cute pausing a second before flipping his BJ. A player trying to figure out if he busted, where in a shoe they would immediately be scooped. And lets not forget the dealer has to flip over all the cards when doing pay/take, this goes much more quickly with shoes, where they can also often grab all the chips they need to pay the table in one pass. The only benefit I can think of is if no one wants a hit in pitch, it goes quicker because everyone can tuck right away.

I have almost always gotten more hands per hour when I play shoe games.

There are more factors at work in game speed than how fast the dealer gets the cards on the felt. When you have civilians physically interacting with the cards this cannot help but slow things down. :eek:
 
I know the place well that that prompted the original post.

The game changed for a few reasons:
1. The dealers hated face-up DD. Several of them were seeing physicians for wrist problems from the repetitive motion of turning over the cards.
2. The place has a new table games mgr. He made some other changes such as the new, 5 minute shuffle on the 6D games. Really absurd. Hopefully the numbers will look worse and he'll be on his way soon...

This place used to be pitch fro DD and they changed it last year to face-up because too many people were mis-adding their hands, hitting busted hands or 21s, etc. Some of the worst players I've ever seen play here.
 
21forme said:
I know the place well that that prompted the original post.

The game changed for a few reasons:
1. The dealers hated face-up DD. Several of them were seeing physicians for wrist problems from the repetitive motion of turning over the cards.
2. The place has a new table games mgr. He made some other changes such as the new, 5 minute shuffle on the 6D games. Really absurd. Hopefully the numbers will look worse and he'll be on his way soon...

This place used to be pitch fro DD and they changed it last year to face-up because too many people were mis-adding their hands, hitting busted hands or 21s, etc. Some of the worst players I've ever seen play here.
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Why don't they just deal it out of a shoe then, one might ask?
 
21forme said:
1. The dealers hated face-up DD. Several of them were seeing physicians for wrist problems from the repetitive motion of turning over the cards.
2. The place has a new table games mgr. He made some other changes such as the new, 5 minute shuffle on the 6D games. Really absurd. Hopefully the numbers will look worse and he'll be on his way soon...
Click to expand...

Did you notice their 2D shuffle changed too....it's practically 5 min, completely excessive, and rather useless as their old shuffle was untrackable...kind of funny. Also, they use the notch now for the cut card, I used to like this place mostly for the great pen dealers gave, now it's barely mediocre.
 
fwb said:
Did you notice their 2D shuffle changed too....it's practically 5 min, completely excessive, and rather useless as their old shuffle was untrackable...kind of funny. Also, they use the notch now for the cut card, I used to like this place mostly for the great pen dealers gave, now it's barely mediocre.
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Agree 100%. Their 6D shuffle now also takes about 5 mins. I've been chatting with the dealers about it and telling them they'll make less tips with the new DD game, as player's won't win very often. :devil:
 
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