Odds of losing 20 hands in a row without any pushes?

[bklynkid222]

Hello!

Hope everyone is well! Just wondering what numbers anyone can come up with of the odds of losing 20 hands in a row with another player at the table (who won and lost a few). I was at Barona after a dry spell ... going out for the first time in a while... bought in for $2000 at the $100 min game (1/5th of my session roll which is 1/10th of my Bankroll). I was going up and down between 4 to $500... then someone else sat down and they put in a new dealer. I kid you not, over the next 3 shoes (double deck hand dealt) I lost the next 20 hands of $100 each... the count remained slightly negative to neutral so I never increased my bet. So... there went part my session roll... Wow what a way to start after not playing for a while.... I was mostly getting 2 card stiffs and breaking or the dealer wiping out my 20s hitting to 21. The other player was not doing that bad at all... Should of sat at third base LOL

I don't respond to posts that often but in this case, I feel I must. Years ago, I did a 2 week stay in Vegas at old Sands, JUST before they blew it up. I am sure it was the Sands where this "event" occurred. I sat down at an empty 5 $ table and proceeded to play a soft positive progression using BS. The dealer who looked like she just showered from making an adult glam film, beat me 20 hands in a row. I know that because I started with a 100 and went straight down to 0. No doubles no splits,just flat 5 $ bets and not one BJ from the friendly porn star look alike. I retreated at 0 then went to the other line of 5$ tables just across from her. There, I found a friendly dealer with a heavy Caribbean accent and natty dreads. I looked at him and he said in almost movie fashion " You get out of here Mon, dis place no good Mon. Stubbornly, I sat down to disprove his spiritual reading. I wouldn't tell the story, if...Math be damned, The exact same sequence of hands occurred AGAIN. Straight down... Then, being a fast learner, I knew something seems a little fishy here.. that was the end of my play at the Sands on that trip. Real story no smoke

 

[DSchles]

Did the dealer shuffle or just pick up the cards and start dealing?

Don

 

[bklynkid222]

Sorry. I took so long. No neither of them shuffled the decks were in the shoe.

 

[bklynkid222]

More clearly written, Neither of the dealers needed to shuffle in my presence. The shoes were full, and they looked like 6 deck shoes. I was playing at the table solo with both dealers. Forgot to mention that.

 

[beating vegas]

This is just my opinion. Most casinos don’t cheat. There maybe some exceptions to the rule in tribal casinos and member only casinos but even then its rare. I prefer to play in casinos that are located in states that have normal gaming enforcement.

From a business point of view they don’t need to cheat. If a casino decides to cheat and or are aware that their staff is they are really fucken dumb and putting themselves in a position of criminal liability. Then comes the civil cases.

 

[KewlJ]

From a business point of view they don’t need to cheat.

No they don't . But guess what, they didn't need to go to dealer h17 either. Or 6:5 BJ after that. They already had an advantage and didn't need to. But that didn't stop them. At video poker casinos didn't need to cut down from 9/6 to 8/6 to 8/5 and even lower. At Roulette they didn't need to add a second zero (00). They already had an advantage with a single zero (0). The casino industry is never satisfied and always seeking an even bigger advantage.

When someone says cheating, we think of a dealer dealing seconds, or maybe some aces or 10 value card removed from the deck. Yes, that kind of blatent cheating is not common now. If it happens at all it is more likely some rouge dealer acting on his own rather than casino sponsored.

But I am more concerned and have been for a while, with "cheating" that involves technology and the usually vague definitions of randomness involving shuffles. You could even argue these attempts shouldn't be called "cheating" but rather something involving the unclear definition of randomness. YOU can argue that. I don't. I think this industry doesn't do anything by mistake. EVERYTHING is planned out and that includes taking advantage of what may look like a loophole (but in reality, is illegal).

Additionally, and on a personal note, casinos don't need to backroom players anymore either. They have the right to back you off, bar you, trespass you on the way out the door. They do NOT have the right to detain a card counter/AP and forcibly escort you to the back room. We, or at least I, thought those days were gone. I have recently learned otherwise.

And this ties in to the discussion that they casinos and casino industry doesn't need to do this or that. But they still do. At least some are very slow to learn anything.

 

[KewlJ]

Now regarding 20 or 23 losses in a row. I always take these discussions with a grain of salt. Does anyone really start counting losing hands from the first loss? No. So I think selective memory comes into play. You lose a number of hands, maybe 8 or 9 hands and you say something to yourself like hey I have lost 9 hands in a row. But did you reallly? Maybe it was 9. Maybe it was 6 and just seemed like 9 to you (especially if you had splits or doubles). Maybe there were a few pushes in there that you just sort of subconsciously dismiss. So, was those 20 losses in a row really 14 or 16?

Losses in bunches happen. The more you play the more you will see. Is there really any difference in losing 15 hands in a row and losing 20 out of 25 hands for a net loss of 15? No. (well unless you are playing a martingale). And, I don't think anyone that plays a reasonable amount will think much of losing 20 out of 25 hands. I dare say, routine.

 

[beating vegas]

No they don't . But guess what, they didn't need to go to dealer h17 either. Or 6:5 BJ after that. They already had an advantage and didn't need to. But that didn't stop them. At video poker casinos didn't need to cut down from 9/6 to 8/6 to 8/5 and even lower. At Roulette they didn't need to add a second zero (00). They already had an advantage with a single zero (0). The casino industry is never satisfied and always seeking an even bigger advantage.

When someone says cheating, we think of a dealer dealing seconds, or maybe some aces or 10 value card removed from the deck. Yes, that kind of blatent cheating is not common now. If it happens at all it is more likely some rouge dealer acting on his own rather than casino sponsored.

But I am more concerned and have been for a while, with "cheating" that involves technology and the usually vague definitions of randomness involving shuffles. You could even argue these attempts shouldn't be called "cheating" but rather something involving the unclear definition of randomness. YOU can argue that. I don't. I think this industry doesn't do anything by mistake. EVERYTHING is planned out and that includes taking advantage of what may look like a loophole (but in reality, is illegal).

Additionally, and on a personal note, casinos don't need to backroom players anymore either. They have the right to back you off, bar you, trespass you on the way out the door. They do NOT have the right to detain a card counter/AP and forcibly escort you to the back room. We, or at least I, thought those days were gone. I have recently learned otherwise.

And this ties in to the discussion that they casinos and casino industry doesn't need to do this or that. But they still do. At least some are very slow to learn anything.

Look its a game. We look for ways to beat the games without breaking laws and they look to increase their profits without breaking laws.
Something is either legal or illegal. If there is no law against it you are allowed to do it. For both the player and the house. As far as the game changes it comes down to the power of the purse. If its a shit game go to another casino to find better game. Also you have to evolve as a player finding better ways to use and extract money out of the casino. The great part as long as there is no law against what your going to do you have no legal liability. Ethical vs unethical is not a concern. The only thing that matters is law the rest is bullshit. As a player I will do anything to take money from casinos as long as it can't put me in prison.

I own a night club. For bottle service I make a 800 percent profit on average depending on the liquor. As long as people are willing to pay I will keep that price. When people stop paying I then have options. A lower the cost ,Get rid of that service or close the business.

I enjoy exploiting casinos. But I'm not going to both and moan when they figure out what happened.

My backoffs usually aren't in real time. Only about 7 maybe 8. They usually come when I return to casino. Just got to charge that shit to the game as they say.

Please when you quote me include all of what I said. I believe in fully quoting people so the context is complete.