A8 vs 5,6

kewljason

kewljason

Well-Known Member
I posted this on another board but didn't get much feedback and would really like to know others thought. I recently have become reluctant to double A8 vs 5 or 6 at the proper index (+1 for my local game) becuase it seems to be a move that draws alot of attention, much like splitting 10's. If your lucky enough that pit critters aren't watching, someone at the table usually makes some kind of comment about this play that can draw attention. am I being overly paranoid? does everyone else double A8 vs 5,6?
 
kewljason said:
I posted this on another board but didn't get much feedback and would really like to know others thought. I recently have become reluctant to double A8 vs 5 or 6 at the proper index (+1 for my local game) becuase it seems to be a move that draws alot of attention, much like splitting 10's. If your lucky enough that pit critters aren't watching, someone at the table usually makes some kind of comment about this play that can draw attention. am I being overly paranoid? does everyone else double A8 vs 5,6?
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i recently did this in two disctinct + count situations, the first in a split of 8s, the dealer tried to brush past me when they saw the A, so i had to stop them. the other people at the table got pissed, because "i took the dealer's ten", and most of them lost on the hand - NOT ME!

in another heads up case, the dealer very reluctantly let me double to get a hard 19!, and i felt a little bit of hesitation, but just said "i have a feeling." in certain games i believe this is even the correct BS move at all counts, or very close, so you could just say this is what "my BS chart said to do." In H17 games, doubling on A8 v 6 is really borderline, some charts say double, some say hit, i don't think doubling A8 looks nearly as bad as splitting 10s, it's an odd ball move, but my god, people double everything A2 v 2 for example! I say go for it!
 
I just had a very fast dealer move to the next player before I had a chance to double my A,8 against a 6. I was pissed. Told them to please *never* assume what my play will be from now on.

Sounds funny, but actually the play I got the most scrutiny on from other players was hitting 12 against 2 or 3. Some guys got downright pissed at me for doing that.
 
Kaiser said:
I just had a very fast dealer move to the next player before I had a chance to double my A,8 against a 6. I was pissed. Told them to please *never* assume what my play will be from now on.
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Often you can get them to give you the card after you see it that way. They really should wait for you to signal, and they have effectively cheated you if they did not. Any casino will give you the option of pulling back your bet, but that's not something you want to do on that particular play.

Kaiser said:
Sounds funny, but actually the play I got the most scrutiny on from other players was hitting 12 against 2 or 3. Some guys got downright pissed at me for doing that.
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Yes, that's universal. Anything that involves drawing more cards than they would have will get you heat. Especially if you both lose- when you win they don't feel like saying very much.
 
Yeah, it usually attracts a lot of attention, and it's a basic strategy move, even.

I'd say it would be useful cover, except it doesn't usually occur that often.
 
Mimosine said:
In H17 games, doubling on A8 v 6 is really borderline, some charts say double, some say hit,
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I always thought doubling A,8 vs 6 was correct in all H17 games for 1-8 decks.
What charts say otherwise?

Anyway, like Zen said, go for it if u want.

Why people even care what other people at the table might think is beyond me.
Pit bosses, maybe, but players?

On Tuesday, I had to signal for a hit on 12 vs 5 FIVE times (once for the dealer and one more for every other player at the table) before I got my 9.
 
Kaiser said:
I just had a very fast dealer move to the next player before I had a chance to double my A,8 against a 6. I was pissed. Told them to please *never* assume what my play will be from now on.

Sounds funny, but actually the play I got the most scrutiny on from other players was hitting 12 against 2 or 3. Some guys got downright pissed at me for doing that.
Click to expand...

as AM said,the dealer should wait for your signal. Last year in Laughlin,I had about $35 on the table in just this situation.As I'm reaching for my chips,dealer hits the player past me with a duece.I raised a rukus and PB allowed me to add the chips and get the duece. To show I was a sport,I let the whole thing ride for the next bet,praying the dealer wouldn't shuffle.I pushed the hand and went down river.
 
Kasi said:
I always thought doubling A,8 vs 6 was correct in all H17 games for 1-8 decks.
What charts say otherwise?
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some charts say yes (i don't have them on hand), some say no. i looked up the math for it and it looks like it should be a BS move in H17, or at the very least it is borderline. at + counts there is no doubt that it is the right move.
 
Doubling

Doubling on A-8 is a very rare move indeed. The vast majority of players will stay with an A-8 and not even consider doubling. That happens to be the correct basic stragedy. Basic stragedy by defintion is when you don't have knowledge of the remaining cards. So your index play of doubling also could be correct.
When I double down on ace-7 I get flack from other players so I say I really believe that this will work and I'm not doing it to harm you. By the way it is a basic stragedy play To double on ace-7 vs a 6-3 as the dealers up card. Watching other's play I'm always impressed when people play Ace-7 by doing something other than stand and are right for doing so.
 
Cardcounter said:
Doubling on A-8 is a very rare move indeed. The vast majority of players will stay with an A-8 and not even consider doubling. That happens to be the correct basic stragedy. Basic stragedy by defintion is when you don't have knowledge of the remaining cards. So your index play of doubling also could be correct.
When I double down on ace-7 I get flack from other players so I say I really believe that this will work and I'm not doing it to harm you. By the way it is a basic stragedy play To double on ace-7 vs a 6-3 as the dealers up card. Watching other's play I'm always impressed when people play Ace-7 by doing something other than stand and are right for doing so.
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The last time I DD on A-7, I got a 3 vs. the dealer 6, everyone was in envy after that!:laugh:
 
Mimosine said:
some charts say yes (i don't have them on hand), some say no. i looked up the math for it and it looks like it should be a BS move in H17, or at the very least it is borderline. at + counts there is no doubt that it is the right move.
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If u ever run into charts that say don't do it, let me know.

It may be borderline but, what I like, is there is only one correct BS play.

Of course it's nice to know the close plays!
 
Doubling on A8 vs 6 is basic strategy for a 6+ deck H17 game. I believe that the KO book provides a generic basic strategy table that doesn't included differences between S17 and H17.
 
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