Education of an AP - Avoid Addiction

aslan

aslan

Well-Known Member
#1
#1
Or (subtitle)---don't be stupid! :whip:
On my 7th outing to AC I won $1,000 playing BJ--hurray! And I put $1,400 in the slots! Stupid! You idiot! Don't you have an ounce of sense! What were you thinking!:whip: Yes, folks! Hanging out at the casinos playing BJ I have become a slot machine addict. This I might add is the first time I didn't hit anything--nada--nothing--not even a $50 payoff! :( They saw me coming. I might add they always saw me coming, only this time they caught me. So now I am in my own mental half-way house for recovering slot machine addicts. :eek: Words of advice, consolation, or upbraiding will be cheerfully accepted, although if you have something punishing to say about my moronic behavoir, save your breath because I have already said it to myself a thousand times over! :cry: I vow never to play another one-armed bandit--ever! Is this too extreme? :confused: How do you play a little, without getting your nose open? I think abstinence is the best way. What say you?
 
R

RJT

Well-Known Member
#3
#3
I'd say stay away from them. Not just from the perspective of an AP, but truthfully it sounds like you were playing with money that you weren't happy to lose. No-one's ever happy to lose, but it sounded like that money mattered to you and it's never a good thing to be playing with money that matters to you.

RJT.
 
G

GeorgeD

Well-Known Member
#4
#4
I read something that you can lose more in an hour playing quarter slots than flat betting $10 BJ with only BS.

If I can only convince my wife of that! Often my BJ winnings go into her slot machines! I will admit that occasionally she has a nice win to offset my loss, but that's more the exception.
 
S

Stoney

Active Member
#5
#5
the bastards take 15 to 20 cents on the dollar in slots, then they cry about AP's beating them out of 1.5 pct. Use your contempt of the Casino management to keep you away from those games....As Darth Vader once said....Luke, use your anger!!!
 
sagefr0g

sagefr0g

Well-Known Member
#6
#6
RJT said:
I'd say stay away from them. Not just from the perspective of an AP, but truthfully it sounds like you were playing with money that you weren't happy to lose. No-one's ever happy to lose, but it sounded like that money mattered to you and it's never a good thing to be playing with money that matters to you.

RJT.
Click to expand...
this is the thing that i just can't understand about bankrolling, ROR and being an AP. how, unless your really weathy to begin with does one conclude that some sum of money doesn't matter to one? and i'm a guy who has no major money concerns at this point.
the only way i can even come close to such a view is when considering the expected value of taking a risk as opposed to the actual degree of risk. but alas i've never been able to consider even a dollar that doesn't matter to me. :confused:
 
S

Stoney

Active Member
#7
#7
this is the thing that i just can't understand about bankrolling, ROR and being an AP. how, unless your really weathy to begin with does one conclude that some sum of money doesn't matter to one?
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Because its fun, sure counting can be a grind, but it beats painting houses or putting up fences for extra cash and of course you always have the chance of having a really good night
 
Automatic Monkey

Automatic Monkey

Banned
#8
#8
aslan said:
Or (subtitle)---don't be stupid! :whip:
On my 7th outing to AC I won $1,000 playing BJ--hurray! And I put $1,400 in the slots! Stupid! You idiot! Don't you have an ounce of sense! What were you thinking!:whip: Yes, folks! Hanging out at the casinos playing BJ I have become a slot machine addict. This I might add is the first time I didn't hit anything--nada--nothing--not even a $50 payoff! :( They saw me coming. I might add they always saw me coming, only this time they caught me. So now I am in my own mental half-way house for recovering slot machine addicts. :eek: Words of advice, consolation, or upbraiding will be cheerfully accepted, although if you have something punishing to say about my moronic behavoir, save your breath because I have already said it to myself a thousand times over! :cry: I vow never to play another one-armed bandit--ever! Is this too extreme? :confused: How do you play a little, without getting your nose open? I think abstinence is the best way. What say you?
Click to expand...
Careful with that! I play VP myself, and have a few times found myself hypnotized by the rhythm and the cards to the point where I was playing longer than I should be.

The difference is, VP properly played on a good machine is +EV or at least neutral with the comps, whereas slots are always a loser unless you are playing a good promotion. But one problem is that the variance on any kind of VP is much higher than on BJ, so a BJ player who puts money into a VP machine is hurting his bankroll to some degree even if he's playing VP with an advantage. There's also the matter of time spend at a VP machine is not time spent at the table which is where I actually make my money.

Your vow to never play slots again is a good one, but you never know where a good promo opportunity might come up.
 
ChefJJ

ChefJJ

Well-Known Member
#9
#9
Stoney said:
Get an xbox 360, its way more fun than slots
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That, my man, is a fact.

If you really want to look for excitement in a casino game other than grinding it out at the blackjack table, shoot some dice for a half hour or so. It can still be a low edge game and has a good bit of entertainment value to it.

good luck
 
ihate17

ihate17

Well-Known Member
#10
#10
One of the many reasons

Yours is just one of the many reasons that most cardcounters land up lifetime losers in casinos. Not playing good games is one of them and in your case, you might say you have a hole in your game. Some smart casinos are alware of these things, know a guy can beat their blackjack game but also know that for every $1,000 he wins at BJ, he throws more away on the machines.

The human side is hurting you. You know that in blackjack there are no jackpots. The big huge hit in blackjack is 3/2, not 1000-1 or whatever a slot pays. You have to understand that in order to get a shot at a huge payout, you must give up long term win, so stay away from slots. VP, the right games are an exception but if you think variance is high in blackjack, VP has it topped.

ihate17
 
R

RJT

Well-Known Member
#11
#11
sagefr0g said:
this is the thing that i just can't understand about bankrolling, ROR and being an AP. how, unless your really weathy to begin with does one conclude that some sum of money doesn't matter to one? and i'm a guy who has no major money concerns at this point.
the only way i can even come close to such a view is when considering the expected value of taking a risk as opposed to the actual degree of risk. but alas i've never been able to consider even a dollar that doesn't matter to me. :confused:
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I can see where you are coming from but the money i play off of when i'm playing in the casino is completely seperated for a blackjack bankroll. As much as i would be gutted if i lost it, i'm settled that that money is not avalible for anything else.
However to lose it playing slot machines would be absolutely gutting. My bankroll is for nothing else but playing blackjack. That's as far as my wealth extends and i wouldn't play it on other games.

RJT.
 
aslan

aslan

Well-Known Member
#12
#12
RJT said:
I'd say stay away from them. Not just from the perspective of an AP, but truthfully it sounds like you were playing with money that you weren't happy to lose. No-one's ever happy to lose, but it sounded like that money mattered to you and it's never a good thing to be playing with money that matters to you.

RJT.
Click to expand...
I am never "happy" to lose money. In this case I could easily afford it, but I was still po'ed at myself for losing it. At the end of the day I was still $150 winner, but I put it and another $400 into the machines. I remember, when I was dead even, I said to myself, "Well I'm either going to win something or lose something--I'm not leaving here even." I would have been better off betting the $400 with the house on the "don't pass" line. But I think the problem is that I treat slot machines as recreation, and then I get mad when I lose. Anyone with any sense knows that there is no place for recreation in the casino; it's a place of business. Now I know a lot of you will take issue with that, but I am not saying you can't have fun gambling; what I am saying is that it is first and foremost business, and if you have fun, that's icing on the cake. Frankly, if I didn't enjoy gambling I wouldn't play BJ to begin with. I'll tell you one group of people who are not there to have fun--that's your opponent, the house with all its staff. They are there to separate you from your money, plain and simple. That's how they pay for the lights and their salaries. They have studied it up one side and down the other to arrive at what they feel is the optimum way to take your money. They are dead in earnest and you should be, too. What I am mad at is that I gave the house better than a 50/50 chance to take my money, and that is dumb, dumb, dumb!
 
aslan

aslan

Well-Known Member
#13
#13
Stoney said:
the bastards take 15 to 20 cents on the dollar in slots, then they cry about AP's beating them out of 1.5 pct. Use your contempt of the Casino management to keep you away from those games....As Darth Vader once said....Luke, use your anger!!!
Click to expand...
That's true! The Casino with all its hype and hoopla is still only out for one thing--to separate you from your money! Next time I'll stick to BJ, or any other game where I have an advantage, and the force will surely be with me. (Formula: the force=playing with an advantage) That makes AP's the Jedi of the 21st century!
 
aslan

aslan

Well-Known Member
#14
#14
sagefr0g said:
this is the thing that i just can't understand about bankrolling, ROR and being an AP. how, unless your really weathy to begin with does one conclude that some sum of money doesn't matter to one? and i'm a guy who has no major money concerns at this point.
the only way i can even come close to such a view is when considering the expected value of taking a risk as opposed to the actual degree of risk. but alas i've never been able to consider even a dollar that doesn't matter to me. :confused:
Click to expand...
You hit it on the head. I get mad when I lose $5 playing pool. Heck, I might tip the waitress $5 for a hamburger and a coke, but I don't like to lose $5 on a bet, and especially if I play without an advantage, as in the case of slots. I might as well just stay home and send the casino a check each month!
 
S

SilentBob420BMFJ

Banned
#15
#15
GeorgeD said:
I read something that you can lose more in an hour playing quarter slots than flat betting $10 BJ with only BS.

If I can only convince my wife of that! Often my BJ winnings go into her slot machines! I will admit that occasionally she has a nice win to offset my loss, but that's more the exception.
Click to expand...
are you sure you didnt mean to say "i read that you can lose more money in 1 hour playing quarter slots than flat betting $10 blackjack with bs FOR 15 HOURS"? because the house edge on quarter slots is in the low 90s, and blackjack is over 99% no matter what the rules are
 
bj bob

bj bob

Well-Known Member
#16
#16
aslan said:
You hit it on the head. I get mad when I lose $5 playing pool. Heck, I might tip the waitress $5 for a hamburger and a coke, but I don't like to lose $5 on a bet, and especially if I play without an advantage, as in the case of slots. I might as well just stay home and send the casino a check each month!
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Don't get too down on yourself, Aslan. On my last week long junket I blew away $1100 on the "circus games" because I had gotten frustrated with my paltry $65.00 winnings from a week of BJ.
On the other side of that coin, to quote a famous Roman AP: "Pecunia lucrata bis est dulcior quam merita."--"Money won is twice as sweet as money earned."
 
S

SilentBob420BMFJ

Banned
#17
#17
Automatic Monkey said:
Careful with that! I play VP myself, and have a few times found myself hypnotized by the rhythm and the cards to the point where I was playing longer than I should be.

The difference is, VP properly played on a good machine is +EV or at least neutral with the comps, whereas slots are always a loser unless you are playing a good promotion. But one problem is that the variance on any kind of VP is much higher than on BJ, so a BJ player who puts money into a VP machine is hurting his bankroll to some degree even if he's playing VP with an advantage. There's also the matter of time spend at a VP machine is not time spent at the table which is where I actually make my money.

Your vow to never play slots again is a good one, but you never know where a good promo opportunity might come up.
Click to expand...
that is false.. the variance is much higher on blackjack, BUT what you meant to say is that without the jackpot (royal flush) the house edge is about 2-3%, and some people never hit the royal as much as they should, but the variance in jacks or better is actually the lowest variance of any game in the casino, its like 19.. btw, variance has nothing to do with winning or losing, it has to do with ups and downs
 
aslan

aslan

Well-Known Member
#18
#18
bj bob said:
Don't get too down on yourself, Aslan. On my last week long junket I blew away $1100 on the "circus games" because I had gotten frustrated with my paltry $65.00 winnings from a week of BJ.
On the other side of that coin, to quote a famous Roman AP: "Pecunia lucrata bis est dulcior quam merita."--"Money won is twice as sweet as money earned."
Click to expand...
Hail Caesar! I know. Doesn't it just gall you when you do something like that? I keep forgetting that the entire casino is decorated and designed to loosen you up and get you to think you have a chance at some big dollars. Yet I can't remember one instance in the last 7 trips to AC of anyone winning any jackpot whatsoever. In Vegas you see lots of jackpots won--not that slots are a good bet anywhere, mind you--but in AC I think they are a whole lot tougher than Vegas when it comes to slots. The next time I feel like playing slots, I think I'll turn to my gamling buddies and ask them if anyone wants to flip coins for $100. It's a lot better bet!
 
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