Im Still Confused-HELP

#1
i get the jist of card counting, count the 10's as plus one, and everything else as negative, and then bet big when count is high- however i still dont understand what the advantage is when the count is high? When there is a high chance of 10s and aces, what does that do for the players that it doesnt do for the dealer

Is it bc the dealer has to deal out to the rest of the table 1st-so theres a good chance that the tens will be dealt out already, and then the dealer hopefully gets a lower card??

Does the number of players at the table do anything to help/hurt the players?

Also, i noticed the casino uses 4-5 decks at once- does that help dampen the advantage of card counting?, or does it have an affect? Your guys help would be greatly appreciated
 

Canceler

Well-Known Member
#3
zengrifter said:
Yaa, King Alex!!! zg
Yeah, the little he thinks he knows is wrong.

King Alex -

Start with the sticky threads at the top of this forum, first the FAQ, then the Free Counting Resources. If you don't know basic strategy for the game you'll be playing, learn that. We'll be glad to help you, but you need to learn the basics first.
 
#4
Canceler said:
Yeah, the little he thinks he knows is wrong.

King Alex -

Start with the sticky threads at the top of this forum, first the FAQ, then the Free Counting Resources. If you don't know basic strategy for the game you'll be playing, learn that. We'll be glad to help you, but you need to learn the basics first.
Well, aren't you helpful - a regular goddamn maitre'de! zg
 

bj bob

Well-Known Member
#7
Canceler said:
Oh come on, zg, we're supposed to be trying to appear friendly here! :p
Yeah Zg. Where the hell is your sensitivity? Did you leave it at Club Fed or somewhere else? Sounds like you need to mellow out in Reno with some soul soothing SD, no?
 
#8
bj bob said:
Yeah Zg. Where the hell is your sensitivity? Did you leave it at Club Fed or somewhere else? Sounds like you need to mellow out in Reno with some soul soothing SD, no?
Right now I'd settle for 6D with 66%! zg
 

wvbjplayer

Well-Known Member
#9
I Am Able to Respond Non-Sarcastically

kingalex1 said:
i get the jist of card counting, count the 10's as plus one, and everything else as negative, and then bet big when count is high- however i still dont understand what the advantage is when the count is high? When there is a high chance of 10s and aces, what does that do for the players that it doesnt do for the dealer

Is it bc the dealer has to deal out to the rest of the table 1st-so theres a good chance that the tens will be dealt out already, and then the dealer hopefully gets a lower card??

Does the number of players at the table do anything to help/hurt the players?

Also, i noticed the casino uses 4-5 decks at once- does that help dampen the advantage of card counting?, or does it have an affect? Your guys help would be greatly appreciated
1. Facecards count as negative 1, not plus 1. Small cards (2s-6s) count as plus 1. Note, also, that this applies only to certain counting systems, such as Hi-Low (the best of the basic systems, and the one I use myself).

1. Players get paid 3:2 for blackjacks, meaning if you bet $10 and get a bj, you win $15. The dealer (house), naturally, enjoys no similar advantage. Furthermore, in a high count, the player has the option of standing on "stiff" (bustable) hands, i.e., 12s-16s, whereas the dealer does not. The dealer always has to draw to 17, giving him a high probability of busting in a high count whenever he DOESN'T have a "pat" hand (17 or higher).

3. The number of players at the table, theoretically, makes no difference at all, since there is no way of predicting WHEN the good cards will spill out. Nevertheless, many card-counters (myself included) prefer to play "heads up," or 1 on 1 w/ the dealer, simply to speed things up, eliminate aggravating misplays by others, and avoid the frustration of having to watch other players (usu "ploppies," or inexperienced players) "eat up" all the good cards.

4. In fact, most casinos today, esp outside Vegas and AC, use 6- or 8-deck shoes. If you can find a 4-deck shoe, you're in good shape. Single or double deck, and you're in heaven. Indeed, all else being equal, the more cards in the shoe, the smaller the card-counter's advantage, insofar as high counts (say, >+5) are less likely to occur with a larger number of decks; the more cards in a shoe, the more evenly they tend to be distributed, making fairly neutral counts the norm. Also, obviously, it's easier to keep track of the count through 4 decks than through 8. Far more important than the number of decks in play, however, is the penetration, or how deeply into the shoe the dealer deals. If there's, say, 85% penetration, meaning the dealer deals all but 15% of the cards, the card-counter will be able to achieve a much more specific, reliable idea of the remaining composition of the shoe than if the dealer dealt merely, say, 75% into the shoe.

Hope this helps. Let me know if you're still confused.

wvbjplayer
 

SD Padres

Well-Known Member
#10
kingalex1 said:
i get the jist of card counting, count the 10's as plus one, and everything else as negative, and then bet big when count is high- however i still dont understand what the advantage is when the count is high? When there is a high chance of 10s and aces, what does that do for the players that it doesnt do for the dealer

Is it bc the dealer has to deal out to the rest of the table 1st-so theres a good chance that the tens will be dealt out already, and then the dealer hopefully gets a lower card??

Does the number of players at the table do anything to help/hurt the players?

Also, i noticed the casino uses 4-5 decks at once- does that help dampen the advantage of card counting?, or does it have an affect? Your guys help would be greatly appreciated
And everyone was worried the movie "21" was gonna hurt the game for AP's. Yeah right...:laugh:
 

bj bob

Well-Known Member
#11
zengrifter said:
Right now I'd settle for 6D with 66%! zg
It's gotten that bad, heah? Poor dude.:cry::cry:
If it gets to the point where you're longing for Harrah's 6D, 6:5, S-17, D10 let me know, there's a good therapist I know up in Irvine. If that doesn't do the trick, I got a handle on a dynamite Medicine Man up at the Paiute Reservation.
 
#12
yeah

lol i havent seen the movie 21, but i want to,

I thought that all numbered cards count as the same- so 2-9 are all the same as far as the count goes- there all plus, and then the faces and aces are negatives.

By penetration you mean that the dealer would deal 15 percent of the deck, and then he would reshuffle, or add in new cards?
 

SD Padres

Well-Known Member
#13
kingalex1 said:
lol i havent seen the movie 21, but i want to,

I thought that all numbered cards count as the same- so 2-9 are all the same as far as the count goes- there all plus, and then the faces and aces are negatives.

It depend on what system you are using. If you are using Hi-Lo then 2-6 are +1, Tens/Aces are -1 and 7-9 are neutral. You would keep a running count but then need to convert that to a true count for playing and betting decisions.

By penetration you mean that the dealer would deal 15 percent of the deck, and then he would reshuffle, or add in new cards?
Yes, penetration means how far into the deck or shoe the dealer deals before a reshuffle. On a 6 deck game you want at least 66%-70% and on an 8 deck game 75-80%. As far has handheld games like double deck I won't play unless I get at least 66% and single deck 50%. Stay away from most single deck games in Vegas. They pay 6:5 on BJ and it's not worth playing. Head north to single deck heaven in Reno for that game. Yeah it's pretty much all H17 but it's single deck with 3:2 on BJ and decent pen. It's how Vegas used to be in the good ol days.
 
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shadroch

Well-Known Member
#14
It doesn't matter if you count tens as positive and 2-9s as negative,or the other way around. Just as long as you know to bet more when there are more tens left,and less when there are more smaller cards left.
 

wvbjplayer

Well-Known Member
#15
shadroch said:
It doesn't matter if you count tens as positive and 2-9s as negative,or the other way around. Just as long as you know to bet more when there are more tens left,and less when there are more smaller cards left.
Seems to me that counting 7s-9s as ANYTHING, plus OR negative, would skew the count to appear disproportionately (un)favorable, barring appropriate adjustments (such as assigning fractional values to mid-sized cards), as are made in the more advanced systems like Uston APC and Revere APM.

wvbjplayer
 
#17
kingalex1 said:
lol i havent seen the movie 21, but i want to,

I thought that all numbered cards count as the same- so 2-9 are all the same as far as the count goes- there all plus, and then the faces and aces are negatives.

By penetration you mean that the dealer would deal 15 percent of the deck, and then he would reshuffle, or add in new cards?

You will never be able to play this game you are a mental case. Get some help for your disorder. Seek a professional mental health worker not advice from a bunch of gamblers.


http://lizditz.typepad.com/i_speak_of_dreams/2007/12/when-will-peopl.html

Dyslexia is a specific learning disability that is neurological in origin. It is characterized by difficulties with accurate and / or fluent word recognition and by poor spelling and decoding abilities. These difficulties typically result from a deficit in the phonological component of language that is often unexpected in relation to other cognitive abilities and the provision of effective classroom instruction. Secondary consequences may include problems in reading comprehension and reduced reading experience that can impede growth of vocabulary and background knowledge.
 
#18
InPlay said:
You will never be able to play this game you are a mental case. Get some help for your disorder. Seek a professional mental health worker not advice from a bunch of gamblers.


http://lizditz.typepad.com/i_speak_of_dreams/2007/12/when-will-peopl.html

Dyslexia is a specific learning disability that is neurological in origin. It is characterized by difficulties with accurate and / or fluent word recognition and by poor spelling and decoding abilities. These difficulties typically result from a deficit in the phonological component of language that is often unexpected in relation to other cognitive abilities and the provision of effective classroom instruction. Secondary consequences may include problems in reading comprehension and reduced reading experience that can impede growth of vocabulary and background knowledge.
He'll be better after the maitri'de escorts him to the stickies. zg
 
#19
Ok so let me get this straight-here are the factors that a player can use to his advantage

1.Whatever the count is
2. The penetration
3. Number of decks used

Is there anything else a player should be looking for?

Oh and i saw the movie 21, it was pretty cool. There idea of having a blackjack team seemed very smart

Obviously it doesnt work as well as it did in the movies or everyone would be trying it

Also, wouldnt it be more beneficial to the player to go one on one w the dealer, that way its alot easier to keep track of the count?
 
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